Quick summary ============= Overall, the meeting went really well! Things that helped were additional preparation notes in the agenda, a requirement to hold discussions on-list instead of dragging out the meeting, and our emphasized ability and willingness to hold votes on-list rather than waiting another month. The meeting started at 20:00 and was over at 21:23, a vast improvement. We beat the 2-hour time limit we set. Because of the emphasis of on-list discussions, a number of the topics in the agenda & summary weren't actually mentioned during the meeting. Instead consider the agenda & summary as a list of ongoing matters for the council. PMS: Versions can have >8 digits. If you want a maximum limit, discuss it with relevant people and propose one. Appeals: Will be handled using dberkholz's proposal: http://archives.gentoo.org/gentoo-council/msg_d7c402fb577a3d5b1707e2bdf4b0a264.xml LDFLAGS="--as-needed" by default: antarus will present a deployment plan to -dev for how this would proceed. GLEP 54: There was a new proposal 12 hours before the meeting. Wait for discussion. Council members should post anything they have to add by the end of the weekend. GLEP 55: Discussion is clearly active. Council members should post anything they have to add by the end of the weekend. GLEP 56: Technically good, still some room for improvement. Council members should post anything they have to add by the end of the weekend. PMS status: This is a discussion that belongs on the mailing list. Council members should post anything they have to add by the end of the weekend. Roll call ========= (here, proxy [by whom] or slacker?) amne here betelgeuse here dberkholz here flameeyes proxy [cardoe] lu_zero here vapier slacker [emergency at work] jokey here Meeting ======= Moderation ---------- Modes +qnm, with voice for people involved in discussions? If it becomes necessary, we'll do it. Leave channel open till then. Time limit ---------- 2 hours? Yes. We'll move any topics we didn't cover to the mailing lists. Updates to last month's topics ============================== http://www.gentoo.org/proj/en/council/meeting-logs/20080508-summary.txt Document of being an active developer ------------------------------------- Requested attendees: araujo Last month: Numerous suggested improvements to info on the certificate. Preparation: araujo needs to post progress, an updated certificate and any new requests to the gentoo-council or gentoo-project list 2+ hours before the meeting. Goal: Suggest changes. This should happen on-list. No discussion expected. Slacker arches -------------- Preparation: vapier needs to send the post 2+ hours before the meeting. Goal: Suggest changes. This should happen on-list. No discussion expected. Can the council help fewer bugs get ignored by arm/sh/s390 teams? ----------------------------------------------------------------- Preparation: Someone on an undermanned arch team needs to describe their workflow on-list 2+ hours before the meeting. Goal: Suggest changes. This should happen on-list. No discussion expected. PMS: Are versions allowed to have more than 8 digits? ----------------------------------------------------- http://archives.gentoo.org/gentoo-dev/msg_db2f5c09c2c0c8b042ca3d0dcec7cdaf.xml https://bugs.gentoo.org/show_bug.cgi?id=188449 Preparation: Do the package maintainers with extremely long PVs need them? The involved packages: sys-process/fuser-bsd sys-apps/net-tools sys-apps/gradm net-im/ntame media-video/captury media-libs/libcaptury media-libs/capseo sys-block/btrace www-apache/mod_depends net-wireless/rt2500 sys-fs/unionfs Preparation: What's the impact of extending versionator.eclass? Goal: With data in hand, make a decision. Decision: We didn't have all of the testing requested. We still voted to allow versions >8 digits. Adding a maximum restriction is a separate question and was not addressed -- if anyone wants this restriction, please discuss with fellow implementors and present your consensus to the council. How to handle appeals --------------------- Preparation: Post to the gentoo-council mailing list 2+ hours before the meeting with your opinion. dberkholz: http://archives.gentoo.org/gentoo-council/msg_d7c402fb577a3d5b1707e2bdf4b0a264.xml Goal: Vote on an approach that was previously posted to the list. Decision: We approved dberkholz's proposal. New topics ========== as-needed by default -------------------- antarus requested that we vote on whether to add it to the default LDFLAGS. Preparation: Post your opinion to the -dev thread "RFC: --as-needed to default LDFLAGS" 2+ hours before the meeting. dberkholz: http://archives.gentoo.org/gentoo-dev/msg_fdfd519c5372394cc7f3aacaefa387b9.xml Goal: Vote. Result: Whether this should be in default LDFLAGS or suggested in make.conf.example wasn't clear. Betelgeuse suggested that we should know the whole tree will build with this LDFLAGS setting (with open bugs for packages that append -Wl,--no-as-needed) before we would consider enabling it by default. Antarus will post a deployment plan to -dev for discussion. We can vote on it on -council as soon as it solidifies. GLEP 54 ------- Preparation: Post your opinion to the -dev thread "A few questions to our nominees" 2+ hours before the meeting. dberkholz: http://archives.gentoo.org/gentoo-dev/msg_c6e4ba8293f50c1e0444e67d59cf85ea.xml lu_zero: http://archives.gentoo.org/gentoo-dev/msg_05614741b3942bfdfb21fd8ebb7955e0.xml Goal: Vote. Result: lu_zero posted a second plan 12 hours ago. Since it hasn't been around long enough to get much feedback, we decided to let them develop and see if the ideas somehow merge. GLEP 55 ------- Preparation: Post your opinion to the -dev thread "GLEP 55" 2+ hours before the meeting. Let it attempt to come to a consensus before we vote. dberkholz: http://archives.gentoo.org/gentoo-dev/msg_c6e4ba8293f50c1e0444e67d59cf85ea.xml Goal: Vote once the discussion's no longer clearly ongoing. We can hold this vote on the -council mailing list instead of waiting for the next meeting. GLEP 56 ------- Preparation: Post your opinion to the -dev thread "[GLEP56] USE flag descriptions in metadata" 2+ hours before the meeting. Let it attempt to come to a consensus before we vote. dberkholz: http://archives.gentoo.org/gentoo-dev/msg_54ee20d2b1d8122370afdd4b3d7aafc9.xml Goal: Vote once the discussion's no longer clearly ongoing. We can hold this vote on the -council mailing list instead of waiting for the next meeting. There is still room for improvement in this GLEP, not so much in its technical aspects but in the way it promotes itself, the possible generation of legacy files, and the tools to use it. Status of PMS ------------- ferringb said: I'd like the council to please discuss the current status of PMS, if the running of it satisfys the councils requirements of a *neutral* standard, if the proposed spec actually meets said standards, and if said spec is actually going to be approved sometimes this side of '09. Preparation: Post your opinion to the -dev thread "One-Day Gentoo Council Reminder for June" 2+ hours before the meeting. dberkholz: http://archives.gentoo.org/gentoo-dev/msg_9e9652212b3aefe09d93fc24c6ec4cb7.xml vapier: http://archives.gentoo.org/gentoo-dev/msg_37b3ca89a1d253516437facd22a3d806.xml Result: This is a discussion that belongs on the mailing list. Council members should post anything they have to add by the end of the weekend.